I am curious. What would be an Atheistic reaction to this article? Let's for the moment give the benefit of the doubt that this was not concocted or planned... An article in the Hindustan Times.
Child identifies killer of last birth!
Alka Rastogi
Lucknow, November 14, 2005
In a baffling case of reincarnation, a five-year-old kid recognised his murderer of 'previous birth'! The incident might raise questions and objections by those who support the theory of life after death.
The case is about Durgesh, a five-year-old child, who identified his murderer of "previous birth" and pointed his finger in packed courtroom at the alleged killer.
Five years ago, on February 28, 2000 Mahipal, a resident of Chhonk in Hathras town was murdered. On the basis of circumstantial evidence the police had arrested Ved Prakash. However, Ved Prakash was released on bail after which he left Hathras and shifted to a distant place.
Recently, the grandmother of Durgesh brought him to court and told her lawyer in the bar room that her murdered son Mahipal has been re-born as her grandson! Durgesh is the son of Mahipal's brother. He is therefore nephew of Mahipal.
The Additional District and sessions Judge, SP Arvind, at first thought the plea to be nonsensical but later permitted District Government Counsel Sahib Singh Chauhan to record statement of Durgesh (Mahipal in previous birth) under Section 311 of the Criminal Procedure Code that allows the prosecution to present new evidence in support of its accusations.
Durgesh was allowed to stand in the witness box. In the court, Durgesh presented a graphic and scenic description of the place of his own murder by Ved Prakash on February 28, 2000 in a rose farm. He also identified the parts of his body where he had received injuries as a result of attack by Ved Prakash.
Ved Prakash's counsel rebutted the statement as a tutoring done by the prosecution. But the court was baffled when the child identified Ved Prakash as "his murderer" in the courtroom.
The judge was taken aback as ved Prakash was never seen in Chhonk village by anyone after the murder, as he was an outsider. The DGP pointed out that there was no possibility of the child having ever seen Ved Prakash in Chhonk ever before or at any point of time of his short life of five years. After the murder Ved Prakash had never visited Chhonk and had even left Hathras town.
The DGC also pointed out that in many international journals accounts of rebirth had been narrated.
After recording the statement of the re-born Mahipal the court adjourned the case till November 30.
7 comments:
Rather than asking an atheist what he thinks of this, I would suggest that you run this by a scientist, atheist or otherwise, and ask him to buy a fare to Village Chhonk. I say this because if this is truly a genuine (by which I mean testable) case of reincarnation, then a lot of science as we know it will be turned upside down and every which way. The scientist will get a nice chunk of change (by which I mean the Nobel Prize) and you will get finder's props. Your name will likely be mentioned in history books of the future.
Balajee, I will repeat the atheist's/skeptic's stance: zero belief against zero evidence. The Hindustan Times story is not evidence for anything, it is an assertion. Not even that, it is the report of an assertion. It will become evidence after:
(1) abovementioned scientist goes and tests the reincarnation claim using repeatable methods;
(2) he publishes his methods and findings in a scientific journal, like NPG for instance;
(3) his work is reviewed by peers and the same conclusion is drawn independently by other scientists.
In any case, the entire case for the supposed reincarnation seems to rest on this:
The DGP pointed out that there was no possibility of the child having ever seen Ved Prakash in Chhonk ever before or at any point of time of his short life of five years.
Has the DGP heard of a wonderful new invention called the camera? Ved Prakash was indicted in the murder of Mahipal. It is conceivable that his photograph was taken by the police at that time. How is the DGP so sure that the child has not seen a photograph of Ved Prakash before?
How is the DGP so sure that the child has not seen Ved Prakash in person before? Was he following around the Mahipal family and Ved Prakash keeping tabs on them the last few years?
How is the DGP sure that the child did not follow a pre-arranged signal from his grandmother or some other plant in the courtroom to point to Ved Prakash? I remember reading somewhere about a horse that could do math. Somebody would write, say 2 + 2 on the blackboard and the horse would, sure enough, tap its hoof four times. The owner of the horse reportedly made a lot of money before people figured out that the horse was following very subtle pre-arranged signals from a shill in the audience. A smart horse, no doubt, but still not sorcery.
I found this statement interesting too:
The DGC also pointed out that in many international journals accounts of rebirth had been narrated.
International journals? I am not sure what this means or implies. Does the DGC mean scientific journals, perhaps, international or otherwise? In that case, my question is: Ummm, which journals exactly would these be? I saw that he did not care to mention any by name. I can look them up if he does tell.
Ok, now that I have told you what an atheist/skeptic would think of this, let me ask: so what would a theist make of this incident? Would he automatically infer divinity of some sort? I am curious, too.
All valid points. Before we go any further, I must confess that I pulled this out of the 'Tabloid' section of the Hindustan Times. There goes any possibility of serious journalism.
I do not typically give any credibility to these stories. I ask the same exact questions. Yes, the basis of this article is that assertion which we have just found to have a large gaping hole that only the Flying Spaghetti Monster can fill.
By the way, I am a Skeptic of Religion as mentioned to you on your blog. I don't think that Religion has anything to do with spirituality. I would question these types of assertions the same way you did.
My guess is a theist would look at it and say.. "Hallelujah! Here is more proof of God's mysterious ways!"
Yep, I know your position. I respect it.
** I was going to wax philosophical here some more, but I'll have to hold my thoughts because duty calls. I'll be back, though **
How're Amrita and her proud Mommy doing?
What is even more interesting for me is what's the court going to do?
Will it take the testimony seriously? If it does, on what basis does it do that?
It might open up a floodgate of reincarnations :)
If it doesn't, same question.
Ashok,
That is a very good point. I do hope the court proceeds carefully and skeptically. The last thing we need is official sanction of superstition in a country that is already crawling with superstition.
Sougata.
Sougata, don't worry about the courts.. they are not known to do anything pathbreaking.. and in this case, thank God for that.. (pun intended..)
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